How silly of me to expect scientific testing data. Had I known that I could just rely on "singing italian's" word for it, I'd have bought a dozen units by now. :P

The "correct answer" from Outlaw would have been something like "Ooops, that was an oversight. Of course, we have test data for all of our products and we'll update the product page an manual with the SNR specifications."

However, based on the response from Ben, it doesn't appear to have been an oversight. So it leaves me wondering why they made such an obvious omission.

*shrug*

Maybe you should audition the Emo XPA-5 and the Outlaw 5000 and let us all know what you think. Is the potentially extra dB ratio above 100dB worth the extra bucks?
As I stated earlier, with any SNR above 100dB, the noise would no longer be discernable. ~83dB at 1 Watt, the 5000's SNR is sure to be somewhere above 100dB at full rated power.

I at least like the distortion specs listed for the 5000. I tend to also rely on third party reviews, like the one Singing Italian has provided, Thanks!
I also have read and watched the listed reviews Ben has referred to. Impressive.
Sure, the SNR was not posted for the 5000, for whatever reason. Certainly won't be a deal breaker for me.

I'm not in the auditioning mood these days. Happy with my Krell amp.

Think about how much time your amp spends @ 1W (or less) and then how much it spends at full rated power. Unless you're DJ'ing raves, I suspect I know the answer and which measurement means more.

I'm glad that you and your compadre will take things on faith and that the withholding of technical data that is standard in the industry doesn't phase you.

One would think that if the news was good it would be shared. If the news isn't so good you appear to get the slow roll.

But hey, anyone who wants to roll the dice can do so. If you don't like it, send it back. Outlaw is good for their word that they'll take it back if you're not happy.

Best,

All I see from your posting, with the repetitive negative feel and "out the side of your mouth" insults to other posters, is someone with an axe to grind. Why are you even on the outlaw forums?

You use things like "roll the dice", take things on "faith", and then say you love your Krell amp. Get over yourself.

I don't see any insults from me here. I can't say the same for you.

I noted the lack of data. Outlaw said "go look at this 3rd party review" if I wanted the data. I did. The data was average. Moving on....

*shrug*

I post here because I'm an Outlaw customer. Feel free to ignore my comments if you don't like them.

You're the one looking for the full rated spec. I happen to think 83 dB @ 1 watt is very good. My perspective of what the full rated spec most likely should be given the reviewed 1 Watt spec was for you. But, as you say, you're not in the market to buy.
So, if amplifiers are very rarely, if ever driven to full rated power, something I agree with, what's so important about needing to see that spec? Maybe you wanted to point out it wasn't there? You did, move on.

Actually, I wasn't "looking for the full rated spec." I was looking for ANY SNR spec. Neither the 1W or the full-rated SNR is listed by Outlaw. I pulled the spec above from the review that was cited. 83db @ 1W is OK. Not awful, but not great either. I wasn't expecting audiophile numbers given the price point, but I don't think it's unreasonable to expect an amplifier manufacturer publish such a common data point, especially given the types of folks that this segment seems to attract....people looking for high performance while not breaking the bank. Wow, that was an awfully long sentence.

I still continue to enjoy what remains of my Outlaw equipment, a couple of LFM-1 units.

Best,

Cheap Shot you say. Not at all. Consumers need to be informed.
Since I first posted the " Cheap Shot" Emotiva Audio customer service continues to fall.

Emotiva Audio Corporation

(615) 790-6754View Additional Phone Numbers135 SE Parkway Ct, Franklin, TN 37064-3968http://www.emotiva.com

BBB® Non-Accredited D- Rating
On a scale of A+ to F Reason for Rating BBB Ratings System Overview
- See more at: http://www.bbb.org/nashville/business-re...h.wo3U6Ryc.dpuf

Outlaw Audio A+ Life Time Rating.

Interesting. Another complaint about shipping charges (not the product). So now there's a whopping TWO complaints in the past 12 months.

*yawn*

You guys are amusing. You take a genuine question about Outlaw "hiding" data on their new amp and turn it into FUD based on two complaints of people who seem to have issues with shipping charges rather than the quality of their purchase.

Is that really the best you can do?

Again, I no longer own my Outlaw amp and I've never owned an Emotiva amp so I don't really have a dog in this fight. However, the response to a relatively innocuous ask about amp specifications has been eye opening. Might I suggest a bit of educational reading:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect

Best,

Gentlemen,

We are not here to talk badly about our competitors. Voicing personal experiences and thoughts when owning other pieces of equipment is perfectly acceptable; however, there is no need to make comments about a competitor's BBB rating. We try not to get too involved in the forums and to instead let things run their course. With that said, when subject matter turns to knocking other companies, we have to draw the line.

It is provocative at best, if not downright confrontational, when someone "yawn(s)" in regards to another's post and continues on to ask if that is the best they can do. This kind of approach is not what we are about at Outlaw Audio.

When someone claims we are hiding things after we have offered to speak with them multiple times, have responded with bench tests, provided an amplifier's SNR at its very worst, and in addition, also provided THD + N then it is clear they will not be satisfied and it is time to move on.

Therefore, this topic will now be locked; it is about time we go back to the hobby that brought us all here and enjoy some music and movies, whether it's on an Emotiva, Krell or Outlaw system, or anything else available in the market place.