any one have any ideas when the new 970 or 990 is coming out? can't wait for hdmi inputs! i assume they will do hdmi switching like the 970/990 do dvi switching. right?

There's a thread somewhere in which Peter Tribeman chimed in and said that while they were actively looking at HDMI v1.3 inputs, they had no specific time frame that they could guarantee. He didn't seem to take much exception to my general-purpose estimates on when anybody will have HDMI v1.3 processors ready - end of 2007 or early 2008 being the absolute soonest that I am guessing any HDMI v1.3 pre/pros might appear (whether it's Outlaw, Anthem, Rotel, Sherwood, Emotiva, Arcam, Adcom, or somebody else).

In other words while hdmi 1.3 "sending' chip is out (i.e. bluray etc)...it hasn't been out yet for the receiving end (i.e. 990, anothem sherwood, etc).

Basically, yeah. The HDMI v1.3 sending chips were pushed hard to be ready in time for the PS3 to include v1.3, but the receiving chips ended up on the sidelines as a result. I've got to assume that at least production samples are available now, but you still have to wrap a platform around that and get all the new decoding modes working - something that will take some time. After all, we haven't even seen DTS-HD Master Audio decoding in any players yet.

Well while it's true that there was a delay between Players with HDMI 1.3 and processors...

The big reason for the delay was entirely due to corporations already having their products lined up for 2006/2007 release.

We're just now seeing HDMI 1.3 hit the stores in Receivers. Currently shipping is the Onkyo unit for instance.

Denon will have their units shipping in June/July.

Arcam will be announcing new Receivers with HDMI 1.3 as well as a Processor with 1.3 at CEDIA, and I believe some if not all those units will be shipping immediately after CEDIA.

Even Theta Digital has an upgrade for their Casablanca III in the works for a November release.

Anthem will have HDMI 1.3 units announced at CEDIA as well.

You will also see a lot of TVs being released that are Deep Color capable at CEDIA.

So I'd suspect that Outlaw if they wanted, could have new processors and receiver announced between September and sometime early next year.

You'd have to figure they would want to get it in for the holidays.

I believe that DTS taking their time is a much bigger reason for delays than the chips.

It's more than just product line-ups: HDMI v1.3 receiver chips were simply not ready until very recently, as all of the chip-makers' attention went to v1.3 transmitter chips once the spec was published (a little gadget called the PS3 needed that). You couldn't very well design the hardware without those chips, and the software development could only go so far without fairly final hardware to drive.

I've long suggested that we would see Outlaw HDMI v1.3 hardware no sooner than Q4 2007, with my realistic expectations landing somewhere in 2008. Depending on how everything goes, part of the decision that Outlaw may be faced with later this year is whether to push to be one of the first with HDMI v1.3 or whether to make sure that their first HDMI v1.3 product is solid (something that is of course possible but certainly not guaranteed considering the new layers of complexity involved). CEDIA is in September. By then, we know that we'll have a couple different Onkyo offerings on the market as well as a few other players in place (Denon, for example). That's also the time frame that the receiver shown at CES by Sherwood was projected to arrive. I don't doubt that we'll start seeing significant announcements at CEDIA, but whether those announced products will ship this fall is going to depend on a lot of variables. I tend to trust in Murphy to exert his full share of influence over those variables, which is why I still retain suspicions that we'll see a steady but perhaps slow trickle of HDMI v1.3 receivers and processors this fall. I hadn't heard specific word of Arcam, Theta, and Anthem having committed to a specific time frame for v1.3 adoption - where have you seen that?

I'm a Systems Integrator, the reps for those companies have mentioned that CEDIA will be where they announce the new 1.3 products. How soon after is a guess due to knowing how quickly those companies deliver after announcing. Theta can delay, delay, delay and usually does. They don't release a product until it's perfect.

Arcam likely has just made rather simple updates to their AVR350 for the Receiver. Their rep says to expect a Receiver replacements with HDMI 1.3 and a replacement for their inexpensive processor (in comparison to their other processor).

Arcam has been developing those products for awhile. Anthem just says look for them to announce new product at CEDIA, announced product doesnt mean shipping.

As for Sherwood Newcastle's Receiver it's going to ship late July/August.

As for chips, if January is recent, then yes it's been recent.

By the end of August we will have Receivers with HDMI 1.3 from Denon, Onkyo, Marantz, Sony, and Pioneer.

If Outlaw is smart they already have things moving forward just waiting on data from DTS...

It wouldn't surprise me to learn that both Sherwood and Outlaw have another processor in the works to be announced end of summer (at least by Sherwood).

Cool. I also have no doubts that Outlaw's chewing on something HDMI v1.3 related - Peter Tribeman has basically said as much, at least in general terms. I'd call January mighty recent for the chips - that's not even four full months ago, after all, and thinking about how much design would have to be impacted by those chips I would think that even "retrofitting" an existing design with them and the new decoding modes would be more than a six-month exercise. It should be an interesting summer/fall, at least.

I don't know what the supply line is like, but Onkyo's 605 receiver is scheduled for late May. It has HDMI 1.3 inputs, DeepColor support, and internal decoding for DTS Master Audio and Dolby TrueHD, and Dolby Digital Plus.

DTS doesn't seem to be the reason for the hold up in the pre-pro community now. I am VERY tempted to try a new 2007 Onkyo, Denon, or Marantz receiver as a pre-pro this summer if the reviews of sound quality and features are positive and bugs are kept to a minimum.

The higher end Onkyo's (top two or three) have Silicon Optix' newest Reon-VX processor with HQV modes for motion adaptive and per-pixel 1080p upscaling and inverse telecine for 480i up to 1080i sources (DeepColor too??) with 1080p source pass through, Texas Instruments' newest DSP chips (for all the new audio formats), and eight of the new TI/Burr-Brown 1796 architecture model DAC's, 36 bit DeepColor support, and may include auto lip synch.

We'll see what Outlaw can come up with and whether it can wipe the floor with these new bad boy receivers. I can't wait to find out.

For those who remember their SATs or have kids taking them now....

The Anthem AVM 30 is to the Outlaw 990 as the Anthem AVM 50 is to the Outlaw ______.

While Outlaw has said they won't have a new pre/pro out for a while it is fun to contemplate what they are cooking up around the campfire!