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#5757 - 01/30/05 10:51 PM FMOD Crossovers?
Res Offline
Deputy Gunslinger

Registered: 12/30/04
Posts: 5
Loc: Chesapeake, VA USA
I have a Denon DVD-1600 which I would like to start using for DVD-A. Problem is that while the Denon has the ability to shunt below 100Hz signal to the LFE Channel it still sends full range signal to the regular channels and my receiver has no analog bass management. A quick search for RCA bass blockers turned up the Harrison Labs FMOD crossovers, and they have 100Hz 12db modules. I'm thinking that 5 of these for the regular channels with the DVD player taking care of transfering the bass to the LFE channel would do the trick. Any recommendations or warnings?

Thanks again all.

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#5758 - 01/31/05 12:10 AM Re: FMOD Crossovers?
alphanstein Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 116
Loc: San Diego, CA
I think your reading the 1600 wrong. The bass management usually has two settings in most applications, setting a speaker to small, means that the signals above 100 or 120Hz will pass and the rest be blocked below, or filtered down a few notches. This means that if you set your Front speaker to small, your getting only 100Hz and above sent to the speaker. Setting it to large should pass the whole spectrum, but sometimes there are still filters, just that they cut out at lower levels which are usually not disclosed.

Are you saying that your 1600 does not have the option to change the Front, Center, and Surrounds to Large or Small?

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#5759 - 01/31/05 07:58 AM Re: FMOD Crossovers?
Res Offline
Deputy Gunslinger

Registered: 12/30/04
Posts: 5
Loc: Chesapeake, VA USA
Here is my understanding, this is clipped from the DVD-1600 Review at http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_9_2/denon-dvd-1600-6-2002.html

Quote:
The 1600 is one of the few DVD-A players to include bass management. You can select "Large" or "Small" for the speakers, delivering a 100 Hz low-pass summation of the five channels to the subwoofer when "Small" is selected. However, all five speakers are all still fed a full range audio spectrum. There is also a Delay Time setting for the center channel and rear surround channels, along with a channel balance control (volume) for the center and rear. It is nice to see this, since, as you are probably aware, you have to connect the multi-channel DVD-A outputs from the DVD-A player to your receiver using 6 analog cables. There is no digital output for DVD-A.
I'd refer directly to the manual but unfortunately Denon doesn't make theirs available online. I'll dig out the paper one and confirm as soon as I can.

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#5760 - 01/31/05 08:46 AM Re: FMOD Crossovers?
gonk Offline
Desperado

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 14049
Loc: Memphis, TN USA
The DVD-1600 is one of their older players, back when bass management in DVD-Audio players was still more unusual than it is today (the reason that Outlaw developed the ICBM ). I don't doubt that Secrets' review is accurate on this point. By the way, the DVD-1600's manual is available from Denon\'s site . I haven't looked through it to see what the manual says on the issue, but many manuals are rather vague about DVD-Audio bass management, especially when it is minimally implemented.

The FMOD crossovers certainly could work. I don't see an immediate problem with it, but it is an unusual approach.
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#5761 - 01/31/05 09:06 AM Re: FMOD Crossovers?
Keta Offline
Desperado

Registered: 12/29/02
Posts: 358
Loc: Central VA
I have the Denon 1600 and this is what the manual says when refering to DVD-A and DVD-V speaker settings:

Large: When speaker supports low-frequency (under 100 Hz) reproduction.
Small: When a speaker does not support low-frequency reproduction.
The size setting for the front speakers is automatically determined by the setting for the subwoofer.


The setting for the Subwoofer is only present or not present. If the mains are set to small and you remove the subwoofer the mains are forced to Large.

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#5762 - 01/31/05 09:01 PM Re: FMOD Crossovers?
alphanstein Offline
Gunslinger

Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 116
Loc: San Diego, CA
So to answer the original question, you do not need the FMODs since setting the 1600 to small will do the same purpose as verified by Keta, and redirect the low signals to the LFE.

Is this the answer you were seeking Res?

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#5763 - 01/31/05 09:47 PM Re: FMOD Crossovers?
Res Offline
Deputy Gunslinger

Registered: 12/30/04
Posts: 5
Loc: Chesapeake, VA USA
Well, I'm now uncertain if full range signal is being sent to the regular channels in small mode, but I can find out I think. I'll feed the front channels to a regular bass managed stereo input on my receiver and switch between large and small. If the bass suddenly cuts out, I'll know I'm good.

And if it's not good.. well, It seems that the FMODs will be okay too. So, again, I'm good.

Thanks all.

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#5764 - 01/31/05 10:14 PM Re: FMOD Crossovers?
Res Offline
Deputy Gunslinger

Registered: 12/30/04
Posts: 5
Loc: Chesapeake, VA USA
Okay, I tested it as described above. There is no difference in the output to the front channels playing DVD-A with the channels set to small or large.

gonk: What would a less unusal approach be? Something like the ICBM? If it comes to that I'll probably just wait until I can afford a 950. (Using an HK65 with a 7100 right now.)

Thanks.

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#5765 - 02/01/05 12:18 AM Re: FMOD Crossovers?
gonk Offline
Desperado

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 14049
Loc: Memphis, TN USA
The only really "usual" methods that I've seen for bass management on DVD-Audio are shrugging and doing without, getting a player with built-in bass management, getting an ICBM, or getting a pre/pro or receiver with some sort of bass management solution (like the 950's analog bass management). Shrugging and doing without is the easiest but least satisfactory, and the ICBM is typically the easiest way to retain existing hardware.
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